Some of the “believers” keep telling me that since I don’t “believe” in the bible I should not quote the bible in my arguments. I have to reminds them time and time again that I did not say that I do not believe in the Bible stories, much of that is historic and believable. I have pointed out many times that I don't believe in the God of the Bible and the so called "morals" he espouses. I also recommend that people read the whole chapter of the book of Numbers 31, not pick out some verses. I am not going to reproduce the bible here. I am sure that most “believers” have one handy and it doesn’t matter which version you use. This bible is allegedly written by God, through "inspired" human beings. This God of the Bible, in which they believe, shows time and time again that he is unforgiving, cruel and vengeful, and the proof is in the book of Numbers. Killing all man, male babies, pregnant women and taking possession of the virgins are not "moral" actions. Sounds more like a holocaust. My innate morals reject all of these biblical morals.
-Thomas Payne (1737-1809), as quoted by Joseph Lewis in Inspiration and Wisdom from the Writings of Thomas Paine:
"When we read in the books ascribed to Moses, Joshua, etc., that they (the Israelites) came by stealth upon whole nations of people, who, as history itself shows, had given them no offence; that they put all those nations to the sword; that they spared neither age nor infancy; that they utterly destroyed men, women, and children; that they left not a soul to breathe — expressions that are repeated over and over again in those books, and that, too, with exulting ferocity — are we sure these things are facts? are we sure that the Creator of man commissioned these things to be done? and are we sure that the books that tell us so were written by his authority?"
"Whence arose all the horrid assassinations of whole nations of men, women, and infants, with which the Bible is filled, and the bloody persecutions and tortures unto death, and religious wars, that since that time have laid Europe in blood and ashes — whence rose they but from this impious thing called revealed religion, and this monstrous belief that God has spoken to man? The lies of the Bible have been the cause of the one, and the lies of the Testament of the other."
"What is it the Testament teaches us?— to believe that the Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married, and the belief of this debauchery is called faith."
"It is from the Bible that man has learned cruelty, rapine and murder; for the belief of a cruel God makes a cruel man."
Yes, Thomas Pain expressed exactly how I feel about the God of the Bible or any other god ever imagined by humans. The only difference I have With Thomas Payne is that he still believes in a Creator. I venture that If he lived now and was aware of the scientific progress we have made and are still making, he would abandon that idea as well. The universe creates itself. There is no supernatural aware personality directing the evolving of the universe. We can call the Universe itself God but that is a misnomer. "god" or "lord" are words meaning "leader", the head of the household, king or emperor. Natural laws exist, and randomly creates the universe and all that is in it, why? Perhaps we will find out, or it could be beyond our capacity to grasp, however, pure fantasy, by believing in a creator who is obviously based on ancient human leaders and thinks and acts like us humans, is patently nonsense.
-Thomas Payne (1737-1809), as quoted by Joseph Lewis in Inspiration and Wisdom from the Writings of Thomas Paine:
"When we read in the books ascribed to Moses, Joshua, etc., that they (the Israelites) came by stealth upon whole nations of people, who, as history itself shows, had given them no offence; that they put all those nations to the sword; that they spared neither age nor infancy; that they utterly destroyed men, women, and children; that they left not a soul to breathe — expressions that are repeated over and over again in those books, and that, too, with exulting ferocity — are we sure these things are facts? are we sure that the Creator of man commissioned these things to be done? and are we sure that the books that tell us so were written by his authority?"
"Whence arose all the horrid assassinations of whole nations of men, women, and infants, with which the Bible is filled, and the bloody persecutions and tortures unto death, and religious wars, that since that time have laid Europe in blood and ashes — whence rose they but from this impious thing called revealed religion, and this monstrous belief that God has spoken to man? The lies of the Bible have been the cause of the one, and the lies of the Testament of the other."
"What is it the Testament teaches us?— to believe that the Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married, and the belief of this debauchery is called faith."
"It is from the Bible that man has learned cruelty, rapine and murder; for the belief of a cruel God makes a cruel man."
Yes, Thomas Pain expressed exactly how I feel about the God of the Bible or any other god ever imagined by humans. The only difference I have With Thomas Payne is that he still believes in a Creator. I venture that If he lived now and was aware of the scientific progress we have made and are still making, he would abandon that idea as well. The universe creates itself. There is no supernatural aware personality directing the evolving of the universe. We can call the Universe itself God but that is a misnomer. "god" or "lord" are words meaning "leader", the head of the household, king or emperor. Natural laws exist, and randomly creates the universe and all that is in it, why? Perhaps we will find out, or it could be beyond our capacity to grasp, however, pure fantasy, by believing in a creator who is obviously based on ancient human leaders and thinks and acts like us humans, is patently nonsense.
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